Well this article is only speculating ; not one sound or song example…
Not keen at all about MPE or MicroTuning and the “potential” opportunities ; I’m already struggling to play decently without to having take care off pressure per finger 
To me it’s similar to the need of having an endless matrix modulation for a synth ; I have never heard any song which really takes of advantage of it with regards to the sounds it would have created…
I’m still ready to change my mind about those topics, off course.
Hi @kiolbo - this album is referenced in the article, at least: https://youtu.be/R-5koLtMy98?si=ClKuhT2D8-0qc-7c I’ve not listened to it it before, but am now! Definitely some interesting tunings going on, that are integral to the quality/effect of the music.
It’s just nice to have these opportunities available once you’re ready to explore them, I reckon, they shouldn’t get in the way otherwise.
(I’m also at a very basic level with my playing, but I think MPE helps, in fact, because I can play very simple things and instead of worrying about virtuosity or anything just focus on connecting with the sound, which a bit of added ‘expression’ can help with.)
Bump for this, alternate tunning support would be awesome
@DDS please record and upvote this thank you
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Microtuning scales would be incredible and it would be something special that sets the UDO apart from most other polys… Please developers read this, and have a look at this topic , its really something cool and opens many new sonic territories!
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microtuning is a question of tonality rather than sound, and if you’ve listened to any non-Western music you have surely heard non-12TET pieces, and that are not just “taking advantage” but are built on these tonal systems that predate what Western music standardised.
Even in Western music it is fairly common to use alternate temperaments, and you can look in youtube for videos of classical pieces played on pianos tuned with different historic temperings to hear (and feel) the difference it can make to a piece of music. sometimes it is very subtle but can still end up making s profiund difference to the impact of a piece.
In popular electronic music, listen to Aphex Twin from the last decades and you’ll hear a lot of alternate tunings - in fact, when he was asked as a prominent synth enthusiast if he likes the Super 6 he said he has no interest in any synth that can’t do microtuning (so come on, George, get Richard on it!)
sure, only a quite small fraction of Western musicians would care to utilise the possibilities of microtuning but it’s silly to play it down as a mere “potential” when 12TET is still a fairly recent system; and while it has its advantages in modulating between keys, many would consider it to be inherently harmonically flawed as a tonal system.
so even if it isn’t for you, I invite you, for the enrichment of music and joy of musicians and synthesists, to support our cause and give your vote for progress!
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This is a fascinating discussion thanks for taking your time here. I think that micro tuning abilities are definitely something that is on the road map for all UDO products. Many questions around how, with a “no screen” UI this is possible but I’m sure it is. What are the best examples of selectable alternate tunings on production analog synths?
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As far as making a shift function on the Super 6 for it, I suppose if there was room on the memory you could have up to 5 alternate tunings on the machine, and use Shift + Mode (on arpeggiator) to scroll through the 5 tunings, assuming there is no function already tied to shift + Mode that I don’t know about. I’m not knowledgeable or particularly invested in microtuning myself but I presume that’d be enough for an average performance.
@udo-audio Really glad this is somewhere down the road!
My advice would be to look at implementing MTS - midi tuning standard - as it is already an industry standard (though sadly under-used thus far).
There is info on the subject here:
The MIDI Tuning Standard is an ultra-high-resolution specification for microtuning MIDI instruments agreed upon by the MIDI Manufacturers Association, and was developed by visionary microtonal music composers Robert Rich and Carter Scholz. The standard includes both Bulk Dump and Single Note microtuning with a resolution of 0.0061 cent, which essentially divides the octave into 196,608 equal parts. It remains among the best and most flexible real-time microtuning formats available today.
The Dave Smith synths apparently implement it. It would happen via sys-ex, which might afterall be best for something as potentially complex as this. Though it would be cool to have some alternate tunings stored, as @RayQ mentioned. Perhaps it could indeed be a shift mode, and the action be something like loading sequences. It might be nice to be able to tune by ear on the machine itself, which could be accomplished using the mod amount knob, perhaps, similar to modulation - with latest key pressed being the one that is actively tuning. Not sure, but the korg mini and monologues offer onboard microtuning. They load the .scl and .kbm files mentioned in the linked article, also (important to note the necessity of keyboard mapping for a proper implementation).
Regardless, Midi Tuning Standard would look to be the way to go, the specifications are available on their website.
Thanks so much for looking into this, it could make the world of difference!
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Has anyone gotten microtuning to work via MPE? My super 6 desktop is ignoring channel pitch bend messages on all channels but 1. Pitch bend messages on channel 1 are bending the pitch of all notes on all channels. If someone has found a workaround that they can share I would appreciate it.
Yes.
There are several steps and things to make sure of:
Starting in Ableton using the ‘External Instrument Device’:
- Your MIDI To is set to SUPER-6 and the Channel selection is ‘MPE’
- Use the Max For Live Device from ODDSound (you have to copy it into your Library)
- See Page 9 of https://oddsound.com/dl/ODDSound_MTS_ESP_Suite_MIDI_Client_Manual.pdf
- That M4L Device is pretty much default using the MIDI PB settings
On your Super-6:
- Make sure you’re on the latest firmware that actually supports MPE
- Load a patch you want
- Hit Shift, then G [MPE]
- Look at Patch Keys 1, 2, 3 (W1, W2, W3)
- If any of those keys are blinking, then click them once so they are SOLID
- Then press Shift again
You’re Done!
If you’re not getting any sound (make sure you’re not in local mode) and make sure you’re getting MIDI to and sound from the device in a simple normal workflow first.
Just Intonation, Pythagorean, etc, but essentially, you could just have ‘User Scales’ and just as you can right now detune the whole synth by little steps, the ability to do this per Key of the 12 tone scale… That way you can do it as you like! For example I would keep C and G as they are and pitch down the E by -14 and the Eflat by +14 and that gives me already just intonation basics when playing in C… You can make it real easy this way! Just the function to set each note of the 12 tone scale as you like it, and we can do whatever we want then… Hope I explain myself easily? You could look at how Logic Pro does it, they have something called ‘User Scale’ in the ‘Tuning’ menu under Project Settings. I think it would be cool to either be able to save this in the Patch, but the possibility to have it as a Global setting would be even better so you can switch patches and not loose it again…